Shamus, Is your solicitation for a kiss a general invitation or ?
I would hate for either of us to feel left out. So here.
Glad to meet you. Maeve
not a captive
JoinedPosts by not a captive
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159
Getting into Arguments with JW's...
by ForbiddenFruit ini'm trying to fade away, but i sometimes find myself in discussions or arguments with jw family/friends/white haired virgin elders.
now, i usually have them beat on things but i'm not very experienced, so i was thinking if you guys could help me put together a list of completely unanswerable questions to pose to my jw friends/family/elders so they can stop bugging me.
if i keep asking them questions they simply cannot answer, then they might leave them alone.
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58
Feeling down
by tec inmy son got suspended from school for fighting.
not just fighting but choking another boy during their fight.
he started it in anger over something the other boy did, but none of that actually matters.
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not a captive
Growing from boy to man is a perilous journey. I really feel for you both.
I have four sons ages 21 to 30. Bullying in every aspect has been felt or perpetrated in their midst. Their physical size is a factor, at least somewhat. The oldest son is 6'3", muscled up, and the weight of a butcher hog. He worked as a bouncer for several years. Clubs have reasons to hire big men--It is a deterent to some trouble. But my other sons are not so large--no clubs would look twice to hire them (Not that I want that!) They are more like my husband and myself. My youngest son is strong but not so heavy, not so tall. He is not going to get big. Everyone at one time or another has tried to bully them -- inschool and others when they were grown and had jobs.
The men get together and talk about fighting and respect. The ex-bouncer has some stories he tells of moments when he abused the power to dominate. In general they are not given to violence and fight only when attacked. But within the family there have been horrendous moments of bullying--each other. I think sometimes I have given birth to Cain and Abel. This is probably not the place to hang out all the dirty laundry even though anyone who has enough of it has a hard time hiding it. But we have survived each other and seem to have come to peace after so many years.
Ask me what I think is the main issue? I think is is rooted in knowing and holding to a sense of intrinsic honor.
Some of my family men have skewed ideas on what honor consists of. They say because I am a woman I don't understand. I think I do understand from the flip-side of a man's honor: They used to view my honor as only the reflected honor of a very honor-conscious husband. My dignity did not belong to me unless my husband chose to give it. And he did not always give it. These kind of disonances in a family are damaging. Children love their parents. My husband is a facinating, hard-working,intriguing and protective person. He is an uneven family man. He moved to the old farm away from the remaining children and me over ten years ago and saw nothing unusual about his living arrangement. I have had a few of my kids go into counseling.( I'm sure my mothering was impeccable) But one thing I am certain of, when we each find the core of our honor it must be something that cannot be robbed nor robed by any one else's actions. We own our power and our worth. And it doesn't matter how big we are or whether we are a man or a woman.
Maybe your son would enjoy these 8 cardinal attributes that a great scientist used to teach along with his chemistry classes. George Washinton Carver was black, born a slave and was orphaned. He was a sickly child who didn't walk until he was 4 years old. He knew about bullying and racism. But he gave his help generously to the world--black and white. He taught as these principles to his students:
1. Be clean inside and out.
2. Neither look up to the rich nor down on the poor.
3. Lose, if need be, without squealing.
4. Win without bragging.
5. Always be considerate of women, children and other people.
6. Be too brave to lie.
7. Be too generous to cheat.
8. Take your share of the world and let others take theirs.
O, and one other thing. There was one thought I tried to instill in all the kids and in the end it has helped them slowly come to some peace. Her it is: If you are bound to raise hell and to do shameful things, at least make yourself tell the truth about what you did. Whatever else tell the truth. If you don't like hearing yourself say what you did, say it anyway. If you hate hearing it, hate saying it, then you may decide not to do it. But don't lie. At least that. It may be the only rope you can throw yourself to climb out on later.
Tammy, I too will pray for him and for you. Tell him that he will make it. Just because this is happening now doesn't mean his life is derailing. It's just tough to grow up. I know you are a good Mom. He's got to be a good boy.
We love you. Maeve
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Jehovah Doesn't allow abortions but will kill millions of Worldly babies at Armagedon....Contradiction??
by Witness 007 inhe see's even "the embryo of us"..."and all it's parts are down in writting.." according to the bible.
yet he will destroy millions of kids and babies because their "worldly" parents closed the door on a witness one busy saturday morning..
contradiction????
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not a captive
Maybe Armegeddon will see those from the nations who gather for war lovingly (Yes, I am being sarcastic) segregate the guilty from the innocent. Maybe it see some kindly step forward from the other side, lift a baby from the arms of their intended victim and take their enemy's infants to raise as their own.
We see this now, do we, in the wars we humans wage?
I think we don't know what Armagedon is.
At the end of the book of Jonah it was Jonah that wanted dead babies, not God."And am I not to feel sorry for Ninevah, the great city, in which there are more than a thousand people who cannot tell their right hand from their left, to say nothing of all the animals?"
Maeve
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127
LOVE your ENEMIES: where Jesus goes wrong
by Terry inmatthew 5:44 "but i say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,.
luke 6:35 "but love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return.
the most radical teaching attributed to jesus has implications if followed.. an invading hoarde of mongols would not be resisted.. a christian husband would not only allow his wife and daughters to be raped; he would be compelled to forgive the rapist, pray for him and offer.
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not a captive
I have a question about loving yor enemy.
Do you think it is okay to run from someone you love because they only want to hurt you?
How about an abusive spouse or parent. Isn't it alright to run?
Jesus healed the servant of the Roman officer but didn't he tell his followers to run when the Roman armies came to injure and further dominate the Jews of Jerusalem?
If we are "wise as serpents and innocent as doves" we do use common sense.
If someone is simply aggressing us as part of a mob and only see us as a faceless mob it is our job to change that as much as possible. First we have to see them as an individual human being so we don't make them an enemy in our heart. Then we look for an opportunity for them to know us as an individual human being.
Jesus and the Samaritan woman was such a moment . He surprised her with basic human decency and interest. Not condescending to her.
That was a successful moment of Jesus lovingly reaching past the walls of prejudice and the woman reaching back.. But it doesn't always happen that way. And your individual actions do not change the whole world.
Later Jesus going to Jerusalem receives not even minimum hospitality from a Samaritan village that he desired to stay in overnight on his way to Jerusalem. The Samaritans take up their traditional stance as "enemies" just because Jesus doesn't intend to camp on them during the advent to Passover and they wanted evidence that he was now throwing over to "the Samaritan side" (People don't seem to want peace in a feud. They seem to want domination. That is a problem for me too). And Jesus' disciples likewise pick up their old "enemy" view of Samaritans and want to go "old testament" on them. James and John say: "Lord, do you want us to call down fire from heaven to burn them up?" But Jesus turned and rebuked them, and they went off into another village.
I have found that Jesus was pretty real about what he expected for his followers. But there is no pleasing some. Christians who make the decision not to live by the sword are accused of cowardice or foolishness. But I find them to be the true pragmatists. Engage with people individually when you can but if you cannot-- leave the scene as Jesus advises (Matthew 10:23). One thing is certain--killing an enemy doesn't eliminate them. It only makes more.
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LOVE your ENEMIES: where Jesus goes wrong
by Terry inmatthew 5:44 "but i say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,.
luke 6:35 "but love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return.
the most radical teaching attributed to jesus has implications if followed.. an invading hoarde of mongols would not be resisted.. a christian husband would not only allow his wife and daughters to be raped; he would be compelled to forgive the rapist, pray for him and offer.
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not a captive
I am going to talk about what we are calling an enemy.
It seems that Jesus spoke words for "enemy" that were rooted in the idea of hating another: Our hate makes the enemy.
The problems I deal with in daily living makes Jesus' teaching especially useful. Getting rid of hatred in a situation is useful. Throwing out fear is also useful and likewise difficult.
Jesus was giving us some really practical advice. Most of what we deal with is personal, more or less. We see the face of our enemy. We may know their name. That is what make us hate them. That is what causes trauma. What they do is personal.
War is not thought of as personal. Yet a book titled On Killing speaks of the greater difficulty war victims have overcoming the horror of injury the more personal it is. Psychologists surveyed war victims in two groups, those whose injuries and loss of family members were as results of say the fire bombing of Dresden and those who had attackers come at them face-to-face. It should not surprise us that those who actually faced the humans who hurt them suffered deeper horror and greater emotional damage than those whose attackers were distant and injured them less directly, almost incidently.
I know that of the physical assaults or threats I've been around, the best outcomes have followed if I can give a rational and peaceful response. If I can demonstrate that I have no intention to do an aggressor harm then they may become reasonable and peaceful. Extend that much consideration to a person and there is a better outcome. I may keep from cultivating ugly feelings about them.
Jesus didn't hate the hater and we don't have to hate and fear each other. But neither do we have to expose ourselves to blind violence by going where there is rampant violence. But if violence does come to us, try to personalize it with kindness and honesty instead of fear and hatred. Don't let hate and fear make you turn someone into an enemy.
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Do Jehovah's Witnesses believe that Jesus died for their sins?
by ThomasCovenant inhaving only been a witness for about 30 years i'm not really sure about the answer.
i would say 'yes' but does anyone know further.. i'm aware of the 'mediator only for the 144,00', but am i correct in saying the wts agrees, and by default all witnesses agree, that jesus died for their sins?.
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not a captive
It's gotta be by grace.
In a topic presented by Terry a few weeks ago there was a debate between a couple of theologians on the inerrancy or infallibility of the scriptures but a chief bit of information was the fact that there was no written body of doctrine during the first 15 years after Jesus' death. So there was no "What Does God Require" brochure. Just grateful sinners who may have done a lot of spontaneous talking.
If it were so complicated then the Roman jailer in Acts who had only part of one night to learn about Jesus' reconciling act wouldn't have made it. (He had to have time to get baptized too.... he and his whole household with him)
Nope, it had to be simple and grace is simple.
After that we have to be honest with God and ourselves.
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Jehovah Witnesses- True Christians?
by rich5678 inwhat do you say to people outside the religion that say jehovah witnesses are the only true christians and they are the only group that follow the bible as opposed to other reilgions?
i see these comments on youtube about videos that addressed the issue with the policy jws follow today.
i am not bitter but i thought if you think that jehovah witnesses are true christians and follow the bible, why not join the group?
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not a captive
If the JWs were true Christians they would follow Christ. Instead they believe that no one can understand Jesus but the FDS. So following the FDS is just the same as following Christ. Because you can't really follow Christ unless you stop trying and follow the FDS instead. You get it?
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Getting into Arguments with JW's...
by ForbiddenFruit ini'm trying to fade away, but i sometimes find myself in discussions or arguments with jw family/friends/white haired virgin elders.
now, i usually have them beat on things but i'm not very experienced, so i was thinking if you guys could help me put together a list of completely unanswerable questions to pose to my jw friends/family/elders so they can stop bugging me.
if i keep asking them questions they simply cannot answer, then they might leave them alone.
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not a captive
MadJ, Sorry I seemed to drop out. Am considering our discussion,how to get it off high center. Also my job taking care of a little boy with CP has been particularly wearing this past week. And I'm going to have to move at the end of the month after my youngest gradutes HS in a couple of weeks. However, this dialog is certainly an exchange that stays present in my thoughts and I hope to give you your due in the next day or so.
I wouldn't just drop out so rudely as that. Maeve
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607 B.C.E. - A Trip To The Local Library! With Pictures!
by mentallyfree31 inwatchtower says 607 bce.
i decided to dig into this matter myself at the public library yesterday.
i examined every book i could find that contained facts about jerusalem.
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not a captive
Thanks for doing the homework on this, mentallyfree. If the WTS believes it stands on facts then they must let this information sink them. But facts are not what floats their boat (not that faith floats it either or they wouldn't tyrannize people who follow Jesus). Faith is not the sum of numbers.
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Do you remember the moment that you stopped believing that it was "The Truth"?
by freeflyingfaerie inwas there one incident or epiphany that struck you hard?
or was it a slow...gradual awakening (no pun)?.
my coming out of the jw coma (as i like to call it) began at a family rendezvous in the beautiful florida gulf coast.
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not a captive
It was Bible reading that got me in trouble and got me out.
The first time they called on me a brother told me that we have to pray the right way to have your prayers heard by God. I told him that wasn't the way the book of Acts had it with the Roman centurian Cornelius. God heard him before Peter even thought of coming to see him. I told the brother that when a person is really seeking, God does listen. Cornelius was just was open to God. I told him that God had answered my prayers before I ever knew he had a name.
I didn't realize that if the brother had pressed that point while I stuck to that single statement, it would have overthrown my study, would have prevented my capture. 21 years later even so small an idea as that one is not allowed in a witness's brain if it runs against the grain of the FDS's literature. They say you have to pray using God's name and have a clear understanding of the "truth" about him before he listens. And they won't let you believe any different.
Then I found the entire theology of Jehovah's Witnesses is summed in three words: Faithful Discreet Slave. Not Jesus, not Jehovah, not even the Bible. Just the Corporation.
It took a year. I didn't know when I started that it would end this way. I had a brother tell me point blank to my question," Might I answer a certain question using the Bible instead of the literature?" The brother said "No" and the other two wouldn't contradict his statement. (Although one refused to answer when I asked if he agreed with Bro.---'s statement) It began unraveling fast then. I had to write the Branch and discuss that with the Brothers. But I could see that I was dealing with a Corporation. By the time I sent in my letter of disassociation I was thoroughly disgusted with the corruption of faith that they tried to work on their members.
But I must have stpped believing it was the "truth" after the first meeting when that one told me to use the literature over the Bible. When I cleaned house that week I found that the sight of the literature disturbed and revolted me. I couldn't keep it in the house anymore. I despised it.
Maeve